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Interview
What were the yuppies doing?
The term “yuppie” has become antiquated cultural shorthand for the kind of pat-of-least-resistance climbers you meet in line at Dean & DeLuca. Horsebit Loafers. Tacchini whites. American Psycho haircut. A successful, unserious person.
Upper Middle spoke to Gottlieb about plunder, cocaine, jogging, and the financialization of Ivy League graduates’ hearts.
The yuppie has mostly faded into cultural caricature. Brie and bottled water are normal now. You argue they are critical to understanding America. How did you come to that conclusion? The book started with me trying to solve a mystery while finishing my PhD at Princeton. Every year, a large portion of my graduating seniors headed to Wall Street. These kids were talented historians; they wrote with style. Their decisions forced me to think about incentives and that pipeline, which we now take for granted, but had to be constructed. The yuppie is a historical creation. It’s what happened when economic forces narrowed the range of possibilities.
First jobs and campus recruiter are a big theme in the book. Why did big banks get so focused on recruiting from elite schools in the 1980s? The industrial corporations that thrived in the middle of the century started struggling to compete in the 1970s. Financialization became the key driver of the economy. That led to deregulation as both parties dismantled the New Deal's regulatory apparatus. Banks become the center of the economy and they needed smart, young people to do the daily work of chopping up, merging, and taking over corporations in pursuit of short-term value.
Yuppies never expected to become plutocrats. The deal was that they would get cut in on what was happening. That was too good a deal to turn down. The share of Penn graduates going into banking jumped from 3% to 35% in just a decade.
A lot of the book is about what it actually means to get cut in on a deal that’s not great for the rest of the country. Why did “yuppie scum” become a thing? The rise of yuppies depends on the fall of other people. It’s a plunder dynamic. A full third of the Fortune 500 ceases to exist in the 1980s — chopped up, merged, taken over — and each transaction is money for the firms that advise them. Also layoffs. There's a direct geographic transfer of wealth: The middle managers who used to go to Rochester to work at Kodak are going to Wall Street instead. There’s a lot of economic violence.
It’s worth noting that there’s real violence too. In Hoboken, thousands of people got displaced by intentional fires. The yuppies weren't lighting the matches; landlords were. But yuppies are creating the dual city we know so well. Service workers earning almost nothing. A thin scrim at the top.
How did the yuppies rationalize their role in the economy? In the 1950s and 1960s, the C-suite, the bankers, and their lawyers were all WASPs who played squash at the Yale Club. Exclusion by design. By the end of the 1980s, 40% of law students are female, and anyone credentialed by a top school — regardless of race [3] — can use career services to land a finance job. The demand for talent supersedes the demand for connections. That shift lets yuppies say: ‘We're here because we worked harder, we're smarter, we did this on our own.’ It legitimates their perch on top of the economy.
There’s also no mass political pushback – at least not in Washington. The person getting the most money from Wall Street in the early 1980s isn't a Republican, it's Chuck Schumer.
There's a sadomasochistic quality to all of this — the suffering doesn't end at the office. To justify your spot atop a brutal hierarchy, you have to prove your fitness in every sphere. A partner at a white-shoe firm in the 1960s billed 1,600 hours; at a takeover firm in the 1980s it was closer to 2,600. That’s 70-hour weeks for 50 weeks a year.
The yuppie work ethic doesn't stay at the office — it leads to a lot of jogging. Is this where today's Whoop-band, sleep-score, marathon-PR self-optimization culture starts?
I interviewed dozens of people who still remembered their marathon finishing times from the early '80s. That self-optimization culture is the water we all swim in now, but it begins here. It's almost Calvinist. You have to suffer.
But cocaine helps…. Cocaine is the perfect drug for the moment. Acid was about ego death and oneness; cocaine is a stimulant that lets you work an eleven-hour day at the office, then go to Limelight.
It seems like the tech industry has supplanted the yuppies in the sense that it plunders different industries. It seems like that’s happened to such a degree yuppies are now on the receiving end. Precarity has moved up and up the class ladder, especially as urban housing has skyrocketed past inflation. The same methods of harvesting value from workers that hit lawyers in the 1980s are being rolled out to ever more prestigious professions — private equity might own your hospital now, or your newsroom, and it wants to harvest more value and lay people off. There are two routes from here. One is to take the bargain even harder: Young bankers leave for hedge funds and private equity because that's where the real money is [4]. The other is opting out.
It does seem like there’s a character that exists now that didn’t use to exist: a yuppie with a social conscience and some interiority. Do you believe in such a thing? Some yuppies, especially the most immiserated bottom ranks, are saying: ‘Maybe I'm not just a handmaiden to capital. Maybe I have more in common with my DoorDash driver or my nail technician. Maybe I'm also a worker.’ Are corporate lawyers ready to ask themselves those questions? I don't know.
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